The Duel II: Spoiler Discussion

I tried to go through all the 2 million pages to find all the spoilers but it was too difficult and annoying. Please don't get mad at me, but are there anymore spoilers besides the 6 finalists and what happened to Landon that has been revealed?

[quote=faceless;60135]I tried to go through all the 2 million pages to find all the spoilers but it was too difficult and annoying. Please don't get mad at me, but are there anymore spoilers besides the 6 finalists and what happened to Landon that has been revealed?[/quote]He got injured and could not continue.

[quote=blanky667;60140]He got injured and could not continue.[/quote] Sorry if you misunderstood me, but I already caught what happened to Landon, just wondering if anything else has been revealed besides those things I wrote.

[quote=faceless;60162]Sorry if you misunderstood me, but I already caught what happened to Landon, just wondering if anything else has been revealed besides those things I wrote.[/quote]Yes, It looks like I did. lol. No worries though.

[QUOTE]I wish Landon, Brad, and co would just forget Evan and Paula and work with the other people in the alliance over them. Who says Evan and Paula have to be in charge, and why would people, especially people who have been doing these challenges years before them, let them be in charge?d Boggles the mind, just like the super alliance on The Island. Everyone can't be in an alliance, either.[/QUOTE] There was a pre-show alliance that will not allow this to happen. Brad, Mark and Evan will always act in each others best interest. All three are masters early in the game at dispersing their influence throughout the cast, each in his own way. Watch for it.

I didn't think Brad and Evan were that good of friends. Are Landon and MJ not as close?

[QUOTE=tjhallow;60263]I didn't think Brad and Evan were that good of friends. Are Landon and MJ not as close?[/QUOTE] The real power players do a great job of masking their friendships. Make no mistakes, these are business friendships first and foremost. I can't help you with Landon and M, though. Both live "off the grid."

[quote=V1man;60271]The real power players do a great job of masking their friendships. Make no mistakes, these are business friendships first and foremost. I can't help you with Landon and M, though. Both live "off the grid."[/quote] Oh okay. I also take it that Brad and Robin aren't close anymore either? Thats pretty weird to see considering they have always had each others back.

[quote=faceless;60162]Sorry if you misunderstood me, but I already caught what happened to Landon, just wondering if anything else has been revealed besides those things I wrote.[/quote] There is a cast discussion thread that has a rough idea of the order that people go home, if that's what you're looking for.

[quote=tjhallow;60275]Oh okay. I also take it that Brad and Robin aren't close anymore either? Thats pretty weird to see considering they have always had each others back.[/quote] I believe it was V1 that pre challenge said everyone heard/saw Robin's erratic behavior on The Island, and no one was going to rely on her in the game, even her "best friends" there (Katie and Brad I am thinking here...), which is why there was a big deal made in the dailies about whether she cried and carried on to get Evan to pick MJ first in the first epi.

[QUOTE=tjhallow;60275]Oh okay. I also take it that Brad and Robin aren't close anymore either? Thats pretty weird to see considering they have always had each others back.[/QUOTE] There are two kinds of people in any alliance... those you want to go to the end with and those you use up and discard as necessary along the way. Brad has game; he knows how to make other players feel valued when they are not, and he knows just when to smile at the camera to let us know he is there to be entertaining. Robin has always been disposable.

[quote=V1man;60297]There are two kinds of people in any alliance... those you want to go to the end with and those you use up and discard as necessary along the way. Brad has game; he knows how to make other players feel valued when they are not, and he knows just when to smile at the camera to let us know he is there to be entertaining. Robin has always been disposable.[/quote] True, however, allianced can be trumped by simply overbearing your opponents in a duel or in the daily challenge. The strongest aspect of an alliance is a challenge where voting determines eliminations - (A Vote Off). I think Evan is playing a smart game period, and keeping his main competitors (Mark, Landon) very close. Brad is also smart enough to keep a low profile. Robin, well she's not that atheletic in my opinion, and after the Island, not that influential either ...... in duel 1, they had strong numbers but even then Robin was at the bottom of the pecking order. From Ep 2 - Kim, was most insightful, and most underestimated. That duel she was in was brutal given the elements, and she won with ease. I think she would have had a chance against anyone in that duel from what I saw. It's surprising that she winds up losing to Jenn. I think kim's victory over Robin was landmark because if nothing else, it enhanced the confidence of the people like Nehemiah, Davis, Issac, and Dunbar to go after the so called big guys (Evan, Mark, Landon). Spoilers also indicate that she beats Ruthie. That too will perhaps give boost the morale of the underdogs. In the past, the "little guys" would just play for the next day as opposed to the longevity of the game. Now, at least while their outside the alliance, they have a formidable plan to disrupt it, even if it doesn't necessarily pan out. I am willing to bet that on future challenges the alliance land scape will forever be changed based on the Duel 2.

[quote=Darock1713;60389] From Ep 2 - Kim, was most insightful, and most underestimated. That duel she was in was brutal given the elements, and she won with ease. I think she would have had a chance against anyone in that duel from what I saw. It's surprising that she winds up losing to Jenn. [/quote] Was it Jenn or Tori? I remember hearing a "brunette" beat Kim, and I was hoping it was Tori since that's more believable.

[quote=cystic;60391]Was it Jenn or Tori? I remember hearing a "brunette" beat Kim, and I was hoping it was Tori since that's more believable.[/quote] From the previews, you may be correct. I was basing this based on the count of the participants watching from the sidelines. However, I was warned several times that this order reported the the spoiler masters wasn't exactly sequential as reported. I do know based on the shirt colors, it is either Jenn or Tori that takes out Jenn, and it is also either Jenn or Tori that goes up against Diem in the same type of Duel (Push Over). Lt. blue shirt vs Green shirt, and from the previews, there there are 2 females with Green shirts (Kim and Diem), and they both appear to be battling in the same duel against someone in a light blue shirt which happen to be worn by both Jenn and Tori. Perhaps Kim does make it further than Jenn. I thought otherwise.

Kim and Tori were Duel II roommates, introduced to each other before the challenge by the good graces of vevmo.com I believe both would have quite rather than go against each other. They are now very close friends.

[QUOTE=V1man;60426]Kim and Tori were Duel II roommates, introduced to each other before the challenge by the good graces of vevmo.com I believe both would have quit rather than go against each other. They are now very close friends.[/QUOTE] I don't understand the second part of your post. They would have quite rather than go against each other? I don't follow hah. EDIT: Oh, wow, disregard this. I just realized you meant quit but mistyped. Now I feel like an idiot for not seeing it and a ******* for pointing it out. My apologies.

[QUOTE=mph922;60508]I don't understand the second part of your post. They would have quite rather than go against each other? I don't follow hah. EDIT: Oh, wow, disregard this. I just realized you meant quit but mistyped. Now I feel like an idiot for not seeing it and a ******* for pointing it out. My apologies.[/QUOTE] No, you are not an idiot... Moderators make typing/spelling errors like everyone else. Our advantage is in being able to alter our comments long after we make fools of ourselves. Yesterday was a 22 hours work day with less than 30 minutes available to be on vevmo. If I'd been on longer, I probably would have made more mistakes. This exchange may help some understand the point I was making: [url=http://vevmo.com/vbimghost.php?do=displayimg&imgid=1759][img]http://vevmo.com/imagehosting/11749e8a4c023234.jpg[/img][/url]

I'm thinking this should be in the speculation thread but 1) I can't find it, and 2) I didn't know if it was okay to post spoilers in your speculations in that thread, so with that said: In the preview with Evan and Mark standing in the middle of no where and Evan screams, do you think it is because Brad is the winner and Evan is pissed (which I would be too)? I think I remember seeing somewhere that someone said that clip was from the final challenge. I don't know, maybe I'm over thinking it.

[quote=V1man;60518]No, you are not an idiot... Moderators make typing/spelling errors like everyone else. Our advantage is in being able to alter our comments long after we make fools of ourselves. Yesterday was a 22 hours work day with less than 30 minutes available to be on vevmo. If I'd been on longer, I probably would have made more mistakes. This exchange may help some understand the point I was making: [URL="http://vevmo.com/vbimghost.php?do=displayimg&imgid=1759"][IMG]http://vevmo.com/imagehosting/11749e8a4c023234.jpg[/IMG][/URL][/quote] I was wondering the same thing since Kim would probably gun for someone in the so called Alliance (Rachel (Jenn's attached) or Paula). I think she and Tori had a good friendship that isn't shown on the challenge. Without to much speculation, I think Jenn is the one that eliminates Kim.

HAHA, is my last post being ignored cause it was totally stupid? Or maybe it was right? Anybody?

[quote=V1man;59022]Deception, careful manipulation of vulnerable players, outright bulling, an out-of-gender alliance and one great hot tub scene that I can't wait to see if BMP has the cajones to show it.[/quote] Sheesh, she sounds like a snake. I've never been a Rachel fan, and now I know why. [quote=V1man;60297]There are two kinds of people in any alliance... those you want to go to the end with and those you use up and discard as necessary along the way. Brad has game; he knows how to make other players feel valued when they are not, and he knows just when to smile at the camera to let us know he is there to be entertaining. Robin has always been disposable.[/quote] What would you describe as the other kind? I'm not a Robin fan either, but it's sad that her friends find her to be expendable. I don't know what she did to burn the bridges with whatever alliances she was hoping to create beforehand, but it must be depressing to know that your friends place the all mighty dollar above your friendship. Reading all these spoilers and hearing about what goes on behind the scenes kinda makes me sick to know that friends would treat friends in such a manner. I would never back stab, mistreat, or go back on my word to any friend regardless of whatever amount of money was involved. I wouldn't be able to sleep at night knowing that I betrayed a friend for money. And if I did happen to win the prize while doing so, I would at least give my pal half the dough to attempt to assuage some of my guilt :wink:. I dunno, maybe it's because I don't have a buttload of friends like some of these people on the show. Maybe it's because they have so many, that they find them to be expendable.

[quote=Heelin';60739]Sheesh, she sounds like a snake. I've never been a Rachel fan, and now I know why. [/quote] What I don't get it is how people cannot like someone for being sneaky, but everyone is sneaky in the game at some point. Not saying you don't have the right to dislike her.

[QUOTE=Dartagnan;60743]What I don't get it is how people cannot like someone for being sneaky, but everyone is sneaky in the game at some point. Not saying you don't have the right to dislike her.[/QUOTE] Some friends of mine who know Rachel admire her game play in Duel II, especially following her somewhat humiliating departure from The Island. In a game with not all that many rules and even fewer which seem to be enforced, sneaky is entirely legal -- and maybe smart. I can't say I'm excited at where this strategy takes Rachel, but she deserves credit at least developing a somewhat bold and unexpected strategy and sticking with it.

I'll be honest, I've never been a huge Rachel fan because I thought she was so awful on her Road Rules season, Gauntlet, and Inferno II. But she didn't bother me on The Island... and hasn't bothered me yet on Duel II... she hasn't given me a reason to dislike her, but she also hasn't given me a reason to start liking her either. I guess I'm indifferent.

[quote=Dartagnan;60743]What I don't get it is how people cannot like someone for being sneaky, but everyone is sneaky in the game at some point. Not saying you don't have the right to dislike her.[/quote] She isn't just sneaky though. She's being deceptive, manipulative, and two-faced. You can't trust whatever she says or does because everything she does is self-serving and for her own benefit.

[quote=Heelin';60750]She isn't just sneaky though. She's being [B]deceptive, manipulative, and two-faced[/B]. You can't trust whatever she says or does because everything she does is self-serving and for her own benefit.[/quote] Is this not how you win on a reality television show?

[QUOTE=Heelin';60739] What would you describe as the other kind? I'm not a Robin fan either, but it's sad that her friends find her to be expendable. I don't know what she did to burn the bridges with whatever alliances she was hoping to create beforehand, but it must be depressing to know that your friends place the all mighty dollar above your friendship. [/QUOTE] It is a game, not an extended camping trip among friends. Honestly, if you lined up cast friends in some pecking order before the challenge began, you could just hand out checks and not bother with the travel, miserable weather and bad food. In this challenge, there is one principle alliance: Mark, Brad and Evan. Everything around them is disposable. They didn't know the design of the game before being told the rules by TJ, but before the challenge they thought through the range of possibilities. All three are very smart guys. They also knew most if not all of the cast namex. They carefully built other alliances to protect their core alliance -- and you will see it play out in the weeks ahead -- if you look for it. I do not think, based on comment of some there at the end, that production ever knew about this alliance, which in some respects makes it all the better. As the game unfolded and they began to see the importance of female partners, some had to be brought close in to the core alliance -- close, but separate. Brad obviously has an alliance with Tori, but at times his two alliances may pull in opposite directions. Whatever alliance Paula thought there would be may quickly have been supplanted in Evan's mind by the potential that these mission partners could be an important part of the finale. From Evan's perspective, who is better to have on your side on the last day of competition, Rachel or Paula? If this harsh reality hits you in the face early in the game, do you not begin to look of opportunities to cast aside unnecessary alliances -- rationalizing that it is their fault, not yours -- and create a new one which though unexpected seems to work out far better benefits than expected.

[quote=RMD1;60753]Is this not how you win on a reality television show?[/quote] Agreed, even Ryan said on this past episode the only person you can trust on these shows is yourself. Heelin', the people that win end up being the people who played the hardest, the meanest, and the most deceptive. [quote]Some friends of mine who know Rachel admire her game play in Duel II, especially following her somewhat humiliating departure from The Island. In a game with not all that many rules and even fewer which seem to be enforced, sneaky is entirely legal -- and maybe smart. I can't say I'm excited at where this strategy takes Rachel, but she deserves credit at least developing a somewhat bold and unexpected strategy and sticking with it. [/quote] Interesting. I do think being sneaky is one of the only ways to win a game like this. But Rachel is always one of my favorites, because she has always known how to play the game well, minus The Island.

[QUOTE=Dartagnan;60760]Agreed, even Ryan said on this past episode the only person you can trust on these shows is yourself. Heelin', the people you win end up being the people who played the hardest, the meanest, and the most deceptive. Interesting. I do think being sneaky is one of the only ways to win a game like this. But Rachel is always one of my favorites, because she has always known how to play the game well, minus The Island.[/QUOTE] Coming back to a challenge after being away for a while probably makes one an outsider -- at least for a while. Some people have strategies to deal with it -- like Mark. Rachel learned this the hard way on The Island. After that challenge ended, she made an effort to network. It pays off for her in NZ. Ruthie dropped out of RW sight after her G2 loss to Beth. Now, back for the first time since then, she will struggle with not being the center of attention among the women. She is a nice person, but not in tough with this cast. As seen in the last episode, she sees herself as an outsider, and it will get worse soon enough.

[QUOTE]In this challenge, there is one principle alliance: Mark, Brad and Evan. Everything around them is disposable.[/QUOTE] It makes them sound very diabolical, doesn't it? I guess there is a certain ruthlessness inherent to being successful in these types of things. For Brad to have this kind of alliance while his fiancee is on the show seems...uncomfortable. I wonder to what extent Tori was aware of all this--maybe it played a part on the fight from the promos? I certainly wouldn't be too happy if my fiancee perceived me as disposable in a game we were both playing, unless of course they had agreed beforehand that he had the best chance at winning and that they would both play toward that goal. It seems very in character for Evan. After allowing himself to be out-maneuvered by Wes on the first duel, I can see why he'd go into this one with a thoroughly thought out plan. V1Man, I think having this information could really make the rest of the season interesting. I know I'll be watching for clues as to what was going on. I find the strategy component to be quite interesting.